DaptoFunlandGuy

At the time, I had only ONE VCR, so I could not dubcopy it. I used only the audio portion of the recording, and cut it up to suit my own devices. Ill try and find the Mini Disc I have that still has a copy of it. Very little of the original recording was used, but excerpts of the reports between Ann Sanders and Adam Walters were slotted in between the spiels and music. The music was mixed by one of the performing DJ's at Utopia 2001, and I put it all together into a looping mix for use in the Space Probe Pre-Show. I think Ride Supervisors withdrew this version a few hours after midnight, for what reasons I dont know, but the ops who were manning the ride that night reported to me that it was because they wanted the "official" Wonderland video airing as usual. (i think also because some of the other Dj's complained that their music wasn't used, and they never received an offer for this to occur...)

i would say almost every superman comic, movie, advertisement, book etc since the concept was first published many years ago.

Micka, I would say this video would have been a promotional video, which would have been shot either pre-open or just after opening for advertising purposes. The vehicles visible in the first drop would undoubtedly be other camera positions for the filming of this shoot. It also looks like it was shot before Snowy had a great bit hill built around it, although its hard to tell. Buzz, I am curious to know whether you obtained a copy of any of the "space probe pre show" videos, in particular the Ann Sanders version, with Adam Walters. I had a copy of that in my posession once, when I mixed up a different queue track for Utopia 2001. The footage of the original advertisement for Demon (to hell and back) also brings back fond memories of Wonderland. I anticipate more coming from you, so keep it up, can't wait to see them... Alex.

Hey Rich, Congratulations on the decision to take the site to the next level. I have been a member of the site for going on a year now and seen it become better and better, even in that time. Having said that, I am dismayed at the decision to make the site a "membership-by-visa" style site. I can understand the reasons for this, being that the costs associated with the running of Roller-Coaster.com.au are not covered by anyone but yourself, and am sincerely thankful that the site is not plagued by advertising, having seen what has become of screamscape.com in the past year. I have given this proposal a lot of thought, before responding to this thread, and I regrettably see that it is necessary for the site to continue to grow into the greatest Australian resource for theme parks and amusements. I have a few questions, and also a few suggestions: the materials supplied to you by persons other than yourself, eg: Liam's theme park videos, photographs of parks and constructions not directly taken by yourself... How will you credit these materials in the "new" site? Will the contributors receive some monetary payment for their contributions? Or will the site rule out all contributions not made by a staff member to retain exclusivity on the material, while losing out on some of the materials that can only be provided by other users than yourself? Will Roller-Coaster.com.au continue to remain wholly owned and operated by yourself, or is there a likelihood that you would take on other "staff" members to support the site, and provide more information that would otherwise be out of your reach? What pre-requisites would there be for someone to become a member of the R-C staff? do they simply need to be a good mate of yours, or are there other, more necessary factors? Being that a lot of our current members are under the age of 18, as we all were once, and that is how our love of theme parks, coasters and amusements came to be, how will you provide those members who are minors with the option to become a member? will the site only permit credit card payment? how else would our younger members pay? Ok, i think i have exhausted my questions - FOR NOW... so here are a few suggestions on things that would make me sign up... Most of these suggestions are things not available on the website, and would need the extensive cooperation of your network of contacts at all 4 big goldcoast parks, not to mention other parks across the country and the world... Exclusive Ride Time - time reserved for paying members of Roller-Coaster.com.au to ride certain attractions at the parks. Behind The Scenes Tours - Allowing R-C members to get up close and personal with the inner workings of some of australia's best theme parks... tour "Scooby Doo Spooky Coaster... with all the lights on...? See what goes on behind the scenes of Dolphin training at Sea World? who knows... the list is endless.... The DVD and Magazine are really good ideas. Why not have a Quarterly Magazine? or a Quarterly DVD? im sure the costs could be worked around to either include the cost of the quarterly issues, or make the subscriptions to the magazines and DVD's slight extras ontop of membership. As far as membership offering customised Avatars and CaptionsSignatures, this is something that has been free on the site for a long time, and having to pay for it all of a sudden is a bit of a shock. I dont think anything currently offered on the site should be charged for in the future, however, new additions to the video library, pictures, etc would be worth the money. I hope I have been able to communicate my opinion here, and look forward to reading both all the other member's opinions, as well as your responses to them Richard, so until then..... I Can't Wait.... Alex.

Another Awesome video buzz. keep them coming!

thats amazing perception you got there Glubbo... lol. We have also remarked on that in the past...

that was an action quote, not just speaking in the third person, you dolt Flea... *Alex Slaps Flea with a large frozen trout*

*Alex slaps Diannasaurus around with a rather large frozen trout* HOW DARE YOU SPEAK THIS WAY! lol. Beast was a rough coaster. I know this, but a lot of woodies are rough, and it comes with age. its part of the experience! But the word is ROUGH, not HORRIBLE.....

i should have been a little more specific. I just realised i used the same term for two different things. when i said "hit the bottom" i meant the bottom of the chute, not the concrete floor of the chute tunnel itself...

this situation could never happen. remember that in normal operation, the boats have a fair separation. if an estop is pressed, then the separation would remain constant for the boats on the lifts, and the rest of the boats would bunch up, towards the bottom of the lift. If asked to make an assumption, I would say that maintenance would need to be present at the bottom of each lift hill for a restart, and only allow boats to mount the lift at safe intervals. How they would do this I dont know, but at a guess, turn on the water, but not the lifts, and give the maintenance guy manual control of the "gate" at the bottom of the lift, and the lift itself, to bring them through at his own control and discretion, or (since the boats do have wheels) they could possibly get away with pushing the boats back up the water chute, away from the lift, to get an even and fair separation.

I agree with you there, but where else can sea world build except out towards the car park? there isnt really very much usable land left on the site, which is why when they build something new, they remove something old... take the waterpark, take bermudalasseters... there isnt much land they can utilise in the park left, unless they... build over the top of the ski lake remove the ski lake remove the dolphin lakes behind endeavour expand out towards the carpark (ala disneyland)

i dont think "shutting off the pumps" would be sufficient to stop a "bump" between two boats. the boats are generally spaced far enough away, just through the procedure of loading the boats... but this is a water ride, for which most of the motion is generated by the water current. Bussy will be able to back this up - that on Snowy River Rampge at WLS, shutting off the pumps takes at least half the course for the boats to touch bottom, and they will continue to float down the course until they hit the bottom.... soooooo that is not an option in an "emergency" style situation. To be honest, I haven't seen a "gating" system on WWF, but a good thing about it is that it does have two lift hills to control the amount of boats in each "zone". I think its safe to assume that while not visible, WWF would have SOME SORT of pneumatic or hydraulic gates that would pop up to prevent a boat entering a dangerous area. As far as the "two boats at the turntable" question, Remember that in a situation such as this, a Maintenance team would need to clear the ride before it is restarted. I cannot imagine WBMW turning on the pumps when they have guests in the boats, in the middle of the circuit. guests would be removed, and maintenance would monitor, oversee and control the release of boats through the circuit at the proper safe intervals.

while both have good points, bear in mind that Sea World have been harboring "Pig" as a recuperation effort. While they have built him a permanent display tank to showcase him to the park, they may still not be permitted to keep him in captivity forever. Its possible sea world has built this tank to utilise him as an attraction to make some money on what would surely be a costly expense in helping him recover. They may also be using these 2 years to give PIG an intensive program to adapt him back into the wild, for an eventual release. "Pig"'s current home is a show tank that is well over 10 years old, so its about due for removal... there could be something to this rumor... but there could be nothing to it as well...

Apparently, Yes. Half of what you listed was a guess or an assumption, which I did not state as fact. When you're wrong, you state it as fact. Remind me again what exactly i was wrong about with Scooby's wheels? The two turntables was about the only thing out of that whole list that I did state as certainty. Everything else was a stated assumption, guess, or a claim to common sense. Funny thing is in the year I have been here thats about all there was that I was wrong about. the difference between you and me is that when I realise I am wrong, I admit it, i dont delete all evidence of it, and then claim for 50 posts in another thread that I never was wrong. Here are the facts Until despatched on the 13th cycle, the oeprators did not feel the noise was a danger When they felt it was a danger, they elected to remove it as soon as possible the new amendments to the manuals will probably not change that because the operators will STILL need to feel it is a danger before doing anything. Maintenance did not tighten the bolts Maintenance signed off on the train being fit for service, when it wasn't. Disney at all times maintained the policies necessary for that ride to be kept in good condition. Maintenance did not follow those policies. this is why the accident happened. It is the fault of Maintenance. they goofed. Disney Didnt.

Very good. you found a quote from a single opinionated person who does not work for DOSH. Now here's DOSH's official word on the same statement... You wanted to get pedantic over the words unusual and different and now you're saying "you could call it..." The single amendment that was recommended would not necessitate bringing in every single cast member to be retrained. I would guess (probably quite rightly, having worked in a park myself) that a communication on a change in procedure, would generally just be an "all staff memo", posted in the ride op sign on area, which would draw their attention to the new amendment in the manuals, and decribe the change in summary on the memo itself. The bottom line is, without this extra line of instruction, it is obvious by fact that the operators still know that if they feel something is unsafe, they should outservice it, or close it down. This extra line just takes the onus of responsibility off Disney, and puts it on the shoulders of the operators themselves. Well lets have a look at your first few posts on that topic shall we? OOOoooops thats right, you got embarassed at how stupid you felt about it so you deleted the thread - Your original post came on swearing blue in the face that a "source" at WBMW told you that they all had motors and brakes and automatic fire detectors in the eyes on the front of the car. When people told you that you were wrong, you got angry, called them names, and said that "you would get more information from your source". You are a FOOL adam. A fool who cannot admit when he is wrong.... no... when its obvious you are wrong, you delete all proof of the fact that you were found to be wrong. You dont know that. What if the upstop fell off on the first cycle? there is no evidence you can provide to suggest that this wouldn't have happened if they had an extra redundant line in a manual that half the operators probably would not even read unless it was bright pink. As has been said to you numerous times before, by numerous people in numerous threads... seeing in retrospect is always 20/20 Vision. There is no physically possible way you can prove or disprove this information. So far as what bussy says as far as Disney being at fault for providing the maintenance by an outside contractor, Yes, in that way, you could blame disney, but I dont specifically blame disney for that decision, as it was a way to keep costs down, WHICH EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE CIVILISED WORLD WILL DO if given the opportunity. The only let down was that the outside contractors did not fulfill their contracts. If they had of fulfilled their contracts, the accident would not have happened, because the contracts specify the procedures to be followed, including the tagging procedure. if the tagging procedure had been followed by maintenance, the train would never have been allowed back on the track without a tightened set of bolts on the upstop guidewheel - front left hand side of train number two's decorative locomotive. You ask me if there was no way the accident could have been prevented? i say there was a way - maintenance following the correct procedure. No operator removing the train or shutting the ride, just maintenance providing a safe vehicle for use on the track, and certifying it correctly for that purpose. thats all. for that reason I DO NOT blame disney in any way shape or form, it is the whole and sole responsiblity of the maintenance team charged with the maintenance, service and repair of that ride - the West Reliability Team.

Where is the evidence that this occurred? they made the decision after the train left. Prove it. Well, i'm pretty sure that this discussion is based on the first accident and subsequent report. With the exception of my mentioning the fact the ride HAD a second accident, I dont see the relevancy of bringing in the reports from the second accident, to back up information from the first. there is no link to the recommendations made by the DOSH in the first incident, and the recommendations, policies or reports made by Disney or Dosh in the Second. My point exactly, finally, proven, and admitted. YOU ARE PRESUMING THIS INFORMATION. If i presume something, I say so. When you presume something, you argue for 45 posts that its fact until someone shoves it up your nether region. This is the same thing that happened with the Scooby Doo Motorised car incident. If there is proof, I haven't found it, and i have spent hours reading all the information associated with these incidents. I do not believe Disney would publish the intricate safety procedures that they instruct their operators on, for one, because if a general public member knew some of the policies, they probably wouldn't ride... am i right Bussy? Daniel? So your presumption is permitted to be stated, however, do not state it as fact. . . . . because god only knows Adam, we have already discovered how absolutely full of it you are.

Hello Craig and welcome to the forums... Before Richard comes in here with a big baseball bat, could I please ask you to read the community guidelines, and try as much as possible to abide by them. In particular the shorthand, and also try to write each post a little less as if you were actually speaking it a little more formal writing while still keeping the conversational edge. Other than that welcome to our wonderful little community, avoid the dark corner where Bussy and Daniel torture small animals, and enjoy!

While im sure your wonderful Oxford dictionary was obliging to supply those definitions, i think the similarities in the two words are irrelevant. If something is unusual, it is not usual, in other words, not what it normally is. If something is different, it is not what it usually is. the waters get muddied there and i don't think arguing the pedantics of the english language matter much in this debate, considering those words (as demonstrated) are pretty similar. Show me the exact wording of this policy. the DOSH report is probably the most detailed report we have on this incident and it doesn't say what the policy instructs the operator to do. I think yet again you are reading your own words into what you read for the benefit of your own argument. You're not listening, are you? as already said, the report doesnt say what the new policy dictates to the operator. it is highly likely that the train will be shunted off, yellow tagged and after a 4 minute downtime to get that specific train off the rails, it is back up and running again... not a two hour down time. And another thing you still aren't listening on - the Disney operators were NEVER retrained after this incident. the only effect this accident had on the operators themselves besides psychological or emotional is a modification to the operations manual that may and or may not make a lick of difference in a future emergency. No, because you have misread and misquoted half of the previous discussions, and the entire DOSH report, meaning once again you're twisting the words to suit yourself, the same way you have done it in countless posts on this forum since you joined. Your opinion is not that of DOSH, because the DOSH opinion you are quoting is a MISQUOTE. Your opinion is not that of Disney, because the Disney opinion you are quoting is a MISQUOTE.

Adam, dont get me wrong, i still agree with you on the subject that the expansion causes the lean, i just think it would lean towards the sun, not away from it - and that is because of the weakened steel.

all three systems work in tandem to form the primary restraints. the seatbelt is applied first, and tightened, then the OTSR is pulled down by hand. its not a ratchet click system, it will fall straight down, but once the operator locks the harness, it will close more, but it will not open. its been known to have winded many riders in it's time. The lap bar would be lowered last. the operators would instruct guests to keep their feet flat on the floor, as if they were not flat on the floor, the bar would lock too high. The bars would actually offer minor (sometimes major) pressure on your upper thigh. it would press until it could not press any more, and then it would back off, about half an inch or so. For those unfamiliar with the restrains on bounty, I would describe it as your standard aircraft seatbelt, the lap bar off of Wipeout, and the chest harness horse collar off some weird carnival attraction like "La Bamba" - basically just a steel bar that comes over your shoulder, forms a U-Shape and is coated with a foamrubber style material that perishes and wears badly in the weather and elements.

each offers a different experience, one is an amusement park... a conglomeration of rides of varying degrees of insanity designed to give you a rush, and make some money in the process. The other is a THEME park, and the single word difference in the description makes all the difference. the theming is what makes the park. You said the amusement parks are more personifying, and that the Disney parks are not "real"... and thats the main point - a theme park is there for you to forget your troubles... and escape to a world where everything is "good". there are no gang wars, shootings and stabbings and violent street crime in a place that is literally out of this world. I visited Disneyland in 1996, and to be honest, when we were inside the park, we could not see anything outside the park walls but sky. It was very easy to forget that on the other side of the walls was the bustling LA traffic. Theme Parks are a place to escape, have fun and forget about life for a while. Amusement Parks do not allow a patron to do so to the same extent. I do not think the two can be compared, because they are so very different in concept and design.

i think the replies from Bus and Joz sum it up well. Adam your arguments make a good point but are nowhere near realistic or practical. Try this - go to the next show you have - i'd say go to the Sydney Royal Easter show, but that would be difficult, but up where you are it should be easy since everyone in Queensland gets a day off to go to the Brisbane show... Now go to the carnival section. I have no idea how big the brisbane carnival is, but it would have to be similar in size to Sydney... Stand right next to the station of a coaster, wild mouse or whatever, and listen to the trains coming out of the station. Pick one that had a distinctly different noise when it is despatched, then concentrate really hard on something else. You can't operate the ride, so try reading a passage from a book or magazine out loud. I say this because reading out loud engages hearing, speech and sight, which is the same thing a ride op engages. Do this for 10 minutes, and without actually looking at the track and following the car, try to pick when this SPECIFIC car comes back into the stationgets despatched again, without losing your place or slowing down your reading out loud. I assure you it is very difficult. I used to be a speech coach and vocal analyst, and to be able to do something like that, in the midst of all the different blaring music, screams, other ride noises, general background noise, and all the rest, it takes a lot of concentration and a lot of training to be able to tune into that one specific noise. The one thing I disagree with in Bussy's post there, is that he says he would close the entire ride. With BTMRR, it doesnt need to be shut down, the train only needs to be shunted off to the service track. On Bush Beast, this is a massive undertaking that must be done by maintenance themselves. On BTMRR, it can be done by the operators in charge of the ride, in a few minutes. I dont think any further discussion on this is warranted. Adam, you and I have thrown arguments back and forth on this subject, with one or the other conceding points here and there. Joz agrees, that the amendments to the manual will not really make much of a difference. Bussy agrees, that he would allow the train to complete its cycle, before removing it from service. I AGREE - that if there were signs of a catastrophic failure, I would not hesitate in E-Stopping the ride, but the point is, there were no signs. the noise was not a sign of a catastrophic failure, only a fault. As we have heard already, a "fault" warning on Demon was something that was regularly ignored by experienced operators, who knew the system to be too frazzled and unreliable to trust. Now that you have the information from the "experts" you asked for, do you now agree?

It is arguable that Bounty's Revenge had a redundant safety system. It is highly possible that the lapbars on Bounty are enough to keep you in the ship, but having said that, again, a person is smart, but people are stupid, and if you were to get an idiot that kept their knees higher up when you lowered the lap bars, then that system would not be effective. I think if anything, the seatbelts were a little redundant, i mean, if the lap bars and the chest harnesses failed, the seatbelts should keep you in your seat, but a lap belt is very easy to come out of, particularly when you're hanging upside down... But as i said, while its arguable, im sure that it was necessary. Taking the incident of the operator who forgot to apply the chest harnesses, and subsequently lost his job, the guests were still ok when they got back down, but only because the lap bars did their job effectively... if the lapbars had've given way, he could have had a few mushed guests there too.

yes but what i mean is that in typical Sunway fashion, the powers that be at wonderland were aware that anything that could be done to save a buck would be helpful and praised by Sunway, so lets only paint 66% of the gondolas and save some more money to throw onto Sunway's Pile...

ive never heard of LIM's being used on a flume drop..? as far as the metal plate on the front, I would think that it would be the mouting plate for the front buffers, to stop the boat ramming the boat in front in brake chutes and station runs, and also to provide a chock for the lift? Most flumes I have seen have used a drive belt, rather than a drive wheel. If the drives on this are your standard tyre drive, then it is most likely doing to be a direct drive system, which would wreak havoc on the motors. Flumes, such as Sea World's Viking's Revenge only use propulsion systems in the flat spots such as the station and the lift hill, and they are rather large and flat drive belts, nearly the width of the boat itself, with a raising bar at the front (could be what the metal plate is for) to lift the train up, to reduce the motions from the rushing water. who knows? probably best to wait for more info from Mack or the park itself...