Australian Ride Safety Culture

[Levithian]

Culture? Money? Training? Money? Time? Money? Investment in their staff? Money? 

Did I mention money? Provide staff with more than 1 day of introductory training then stop throwing them straight in with existing staff in a buddy training system to learn plenty of their bad habits would make a difference. 

Ohh and operate rides with a full compliment of trained, experienced staff instead of short changing your guests by running with the absolute minimum you can. Trained, experienced and full compliment being the key words here. For example, something we have all experienced; What is the point of having a sorter if they don't do their job and dispatches routinely leave with empty seats?

Ultimately it has to come down to management. They could look into how effective their procedures are in relation to load/wait times and improve upon the standards with training and even possible incentives, but the long and the short of it is, they don't seem to care enough about people like us critiquing their processes and/or want to put the money into labour hours for both additional, more indepth training and extra staff to make a difference. Until that changes (and we have yet to see any evidence of that in a very long time), it's going to be more of the same and everyone is going to keep seeing the 2-3hr wait times during peak periods. 

Edited January 31, 2023 by Levithian

[HussRainbow87]

10 hours ago, New display name said:

@jozI'm not saying anybody is incorrect and I could be way off the mark.  It was only 2 days ago I thought they still sold individual tickets.

LPS is in a different state, so QLD health and Safety is a different entity to NSW health and safety.  Very likely every state has its own rules.

Wouldn’t exactly say that, we operate and maintain our rides the exact same way in all four states that we visit. Checks and audits are fairly similar also. 

[New display name]

@HussRainbow87I believe you don't have the same set of regulations as a theme park in QLD because you don't qualify as a major amusement park.  If you don't qualify you aren't affected by the rules QLD H & S put on theme parks.

The safety case and licence regime for major amusement parks requires a comprehensive and integrated approach for managing amusement device safety. As part of the safety case regime, major amusement parks are required to:

• identify potential incidents and hazards involving amusement devices at the park
• carry out a safety assessment for amusement devices at the park
• implement control measures designed to eliminate or minimise the risk of an incident occurring
• prepare an emergency plan, consult with emergency services and implement the plan when required
• document information about the amusement devices at the park—for example about maintenance, inspections and testing of devices, and operator training
• implement a safety management system for amusement devices at the park
• consult with workers—for example in relation to the emergency plan, safety management system and preparing and reviewing the safety case monitor the effectiveness of the park’s safety case.

 

This isn't a theme park rides are safer than traveling rides moment, it's the Government sees theme parks have a higher risk of accidents or incidents occurring.

[HussRainbow87]

Just now, New display name said:

@HussRainbow87I believe you don't have the same set of regulations as a theme park in QLD because you don't qualify as a major amusement park.  If you don't qualify you aren't affected by the rules QLD H & S put on theme parks.

The safety case and licence regime for major amusement parks requires a comprehensive and integrated approach for managing amusement device safety. As part of the safety case regime, major amusement parks are required to:

• identify potential incidents and hazards involving amusement devices at the park
• carry out a safety assessment for amusement devices at the park
• implement control measures designed to eliminate or minimise the risk of an incident occurring
• prepare an emergency plan, consult with emergency services and implement the plan when required
• document information about the amusement devices at the park—for example about maintenance, inspections and testing of devices, and operator training
• implement a safety management system for amusement devices at the park
• consult with workers—for example in relation to the emergency plan, safety management system and preparing and reviewing the safety case monitor the effectiveness of the park’s safety case.

 

This isn't a theme park rides are safer than traveling rides moment, it's the Government sees theme parks have a higher risk of accidents or incidents occurring.

Everything you just stated applies to us. Our logbooks include all of those documents. 

[New display name]

That was only the front page @HussRainbow87 

 

[HussRainbow87]

2 minutes ago, New display name said:

That was only the front page @HussRainbow87 

 

Fair enough, but our regulations wouldn’t be much different. An amusement device is an amusement device. Regardless of travelling or park. It was more so a comment on how there’s isn’t too much difference in regards to how states regulate the use of amusement devices. 

[New display name]

I can't find any requirement for a theme park in NSW to have a theme park licence.

and

Even when you are following the same process, like:

• identify potential incidents and hazards involving amusement devices at the park

You are going to have very different outcomes.

[REGIE]

If I was a millionaire the first thing I would build is a theme park in between Coffs  and Gold Coast. Probably around Byron because it’s got lots of traffic and it’s a tourist attraction. But I would rather one in yamba area but there’s not enough people there

[Brad2912]

5 minutes ago, REGIE said:

If I was a millionaire the first thing I would build is a theme park in between Coffs  and Gold Coast. Probably around Byron because it’s got lots of traffic and it’s a tourist attraction. But I would rather one in yamba area but there’s not enough people there

That would be a sure fire way to not be a millionaire for much longer 

firstly, Byron people are in uproar when an out of towner wants to open a fast food franchise. You want to open a theme park. You have zero chance of getting the land required zoned for what you require. If you found land, you’d be bankrupted by the drawn out development and approval process as thousands of locals object to the application.

If you by a miraculous chance managed to get the park built you’ve then got the issue of attendance with most of the locals against it, and the nearest population centre already serviced by established theme parks meaning unless you had something significantly better to offer, they wouldn’t make the trek down. Byron is exceedingly expensive and accommodation options limited which makes short stays expensive and less attractive than going to the GC. 

[Naazon]

Better NSW location is Western Syd or between Newcastle and or Gosford and Sydney. 

[Levithian]

3 hours ago, New display name said:

@HussRainbow87I believe you don't have the same set of regulations as a theme park in QLD because you don't qualify as a major amusement park.  If you don't qualify you aren't affected by the rules QLD H & S put on theme parks.

The safety case and licence regime for major amusement parks requires a comprehensive and integrated approach for managing amusement device safety. As part of the safety case regime, major amusement parks are required to:

• identify potential incidents and hazards involving amusement devices at the park
• carry out a safety assessment for amusement devices at the park
• implement control measures designed to eliminate or minimise the risk of an incident occurring
• prepare an emergency plan, consult with emergency services and implement the plan when required
• document information about the amusement devices at the park—for example about maintenance, inspections and testing of devices, and operator training
• implement a safety management system for amusement devices at the park
• consult with workers—for example in relation to the emergency plan, safety management system and preparing and reviewing the safety case monitor the effectiveness of the park’s safety case.

 

This isn't a theme park rides are safer than traveling rides moment, it's the Government sees theme parks have a higher risk of accidents or incidents occurring.

The same requirements apply to all operators whether you meet the requirements for an amusement park licence or not. 

The new regulations apply to all rides and amusement devices above a certain class, that is what they were developed for. Doesn't matter how many rides you operate or large your company is, you could operate one single class 2 ride and still have to abide by the same regulations. It covers all instances of operating these devices, so fairs, fetes, shows, etc. 

For reference, an example of a class 2 ride is a red baron style kids ride or something like a mini drop tower. It's basically the minimum class you'll find for pretty much any actual moving ride.

Worth noting that the intention is actually to develop a national code of practice, even though, as pointed out, other states have similar requirements from worksafe. 

Quote

 

Most amusement devices require registration as an item of plant and design registration. The Work Health and Safety Regulation 2011 requires registration of amusement devices classified by section 2.1 of AS 3533.1:2009 Amusement Rides and Devices – Design and construction with exception to the following devices and structures:

• an amusement ride or device classified as class 1 under section 2.1 of AS 3533.1:2009 (Amusement rides and devices—Design and construction);
• playground structures;
• water slides where water facilitates patrons to slide easily, predominantly under gravity, along a static structure;
• wave generators where patrons do not come into contact with the parts of machinery used for generating water waves;
• inflatable devices, other than inflatable devices (continuously blown) with a platform height of 3 metres or more.

Amusement device regulation | WorkSafe.qld.gov.au

 

Edited February 1, 2023 by Levithian

[New display name]

@Levithianmaybe you should have a lie-down because you're not doing very good today.

[Levithian]

Maybe you should understand there is a national practice in place regardless of state rules? Do me a favour and post some of the requirements on inspections and log book requires from worksafe. I'll wait. 

Amusement Devices - Information Sheet for Annual Inspections and Records - Updated September 2022.pdf (safeworkaustralia.gov.au)

Edited February 1, 2023 by Levithian

[New display name]

No thanks, I'm not going to have a debate with someone who is using google and their own interpretation of what they are reading for their argument.   

Nothing personal but if @Slickgives me some information on photography and another person gives me information on the same subject they found on google, who should I talk to?

Edited February 1, 2023 by New display name

[Guest 239]

1 hour ago, Naazon said:

Better NSW location is Western Syd or between Newcastle and or Gosford and Sydney. 

I always thought Williamstown would make a great location for a big resort if an international player came to Australia. You've got plenty of flat land, a nearby port and city, and a pretty decent airport for people to get to it. 

[New display name]

@LevithianI don't want to come off as dismissive to you but sometimes when you say one thing around here, everyone jumps on you and the conversations goes into a direction you never intended to be involved with.

My statement was:

"LPS is in a different state, so QLD health and Safety is a different entity to NSW health and safety.  Very likely every state has its own rules".

My statement is true, 

QLD - theme park licence required.

NSW - no theme park licence required.

Are they not different rules?

[Dean Barnett]

Regardless of laws involved there's heaps of things they do that have nothing to do with safety that hinders operations

• Running one train in peak periods
• Not allowing rerides without exiting platform
• Rivals RFID thingy
• the list goes on..

[New display name]

4 minutes ago, Dean Barnett said:

Regardless of laws involved there's heaps of things they do that have nothing to do with safety that hinders operations

• Running one train in peak periods
• Not allowing rerides without exiting platform
• Rivals RFID thingy
• the list goes on..

Apparently not, you only listed 3 things.🤪

[Gazza]

Quote

Not allowing rerides without exiting platform

When is anyone getting re-rides these days? The queues are rarely that short.

And if the park is empty enough that there are spare seats for re-rides, they probably don't need a 2nd train that day.

[joz]

13 minutes ago, Dean Barnett said:

Running one train in peak periods

MW has consistently been running 2 trains on Superman and Rivals all through the school holidays. If they have the trains available for peak season, they use them. Much as you have been for a few weeks now, you're actually talking nonsense.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

16 minutes ago, Dean Barnett said:

Regardless of laws involved there's heaps of things they do that have nothing to do with safety that hinders operations

• Running one train in peak periods
• Not allowing rerides without exiting platform
• Rivals RFID thingy
• the list goes on..

11 minutes ago, New display name said:

Apparently not, you only listed 3 things.🤪

2 things. pretty sure only Taipan has the RFID tags, not Rivals.

9 minutes ago, Gazza said:

When is anyone getting re-rides these days? The queues are rarely that short.

It's true though - the whole exit the ride envelope, and walk all the way around and re-enter the queue thing is a bit crap if the queue doesn't have a cycle's worth of people. I've even seen it happen during a walk-on day on the CAROUSEL.

It's probably part of the same crap about not admitting the next group of people until all current riders are clear of the exit gate too - so if we did away with that rule and opened the air gates earlier, you could probably let rerides happen without leaving the station, if there were enough spare seats.

2 minutes ago, joz said:

Much as you have been for a few weeks now, you're actually talking nonsense.

Bit more than a few weeks, don't you reckon?  

[New display name]

40 minutes ago, DaptoFunlandGuy said:

It's true though - the whole exit the ride envelope, and walk all the way around and re-enter the queue thing is a bit crap if the queue doesn't have a cycle's worth of people. I've even seen it happen during a walk-on day on the CAROUSEL.

At Knotts, I witnessed a restraint not being checked after a child getting off the ride was told they could re-ride.  The problem was the child had unlocked itself and the ride attendant didn't notice.  Halfway through the cycle the ride attendant stopped the ride and did up the child's restraint.  Procedures like making everybody exit means the ride attendant does the same routine every cycle.  You want to limit people making decisions as much as possible.  Same reason why village always empty the ride after a stoppage.

As a kid I once rode the log ride at DW at least 14 times in a row without leaving the ride once and every time I came around, the attendant said, "do you want to go again".

 

Back in the day🤪, if you conned your parents in having the day off school, DW would be so quiet and in the super quiet moments you could get a ride operator to follow you around.  DW would have a ride operator that would switch between operating multiply rides.  You would ride the enterprise with your mate and when the ride stopped the operator would follow you to the next ride you wanted to ride.  I don’t even know DW managed to make money some days.

Edited February 1, 2023 by New display name

[Gobbledok]

When I was at Knotts one time on a coaster they let me reride but we all still had to get off, stand on the exit platform and then get back on so they did their normal restraint routine. That seems to make sense and be a good middle ground between allowing rerides and breaking the routine. 

[Dean Barnett]

2 hours ago, New display name said:

Apparently not, you only listed 3 things.🤪

Not putting much effort into my posts latetly because they've been mysteriously disappearing.

Here's some more:

• Opening entry airgates just after the train is unlocked.
• Closing entry airgates immeditely once the riders have advanced (this allows more time to prepare the next train)
• Self grouping in quiet periods 
• Adding screens on platforms for attendants to indicate which seats are locked or not
• Countdown timers for dispatch targets
•  

 

2 hours ago, New display name said:

  Procedures like making everybody exit means the ride attendant does the same routine every cycle.  You want to limit people making decisions as much as possible.  Same reason why village always empty the ride after a stoppage.

You've witnessed an isolated incident - I've reridden countless coasters (including Six Flags that have very safe but fast operations) where they actually did follow a smarter procedure - resecure the train after closing the exit gate - or better still - never unlocking the train in the first place. 

 

2 hours ago, Gazza said:

When is anyone getting re-rides these days? The queues are rarely that short.

And if the park is empty enough that there are spare seats for re-rides, they probably don't need a 2nd train that day.

These points arent mutually exclusive 

[Spotty]

3 hours ago, New display name said:

Procedures like making everybody exit means the ride attendant does the same routine every cycle.  You want to limit people making decisions as much as possible.  Same reason why village always empty the ride after a stoppage.

 

Just a FYI, not every time there is a ride stop will it require an evacuation of the ride. Generally speaking most of the rides when a fault is detected the supervisor will first try to clear the fault. An evacuation is generally a last resort if the fault can not be fixed. Depending on the exact cause of the fault will determine if an evacuation is required. 

Example being, Movie World has 2 distinct voiceovers for guests when a ride stops. A female VoiceOver that basically states that the ride has stopped and will restart shortly. This would be cycled for several minutes while a supervisor scrambles to fix the fault (Scooby Doo was a particular culprit for this in the early 2010's). If after a certain amount of time of the ride being stopped, the procedure was to go into a forced evacuation. I think this was around 10 minutes or so but I could be wrong. This is when a male VoiceOver would play giving instructions on what to do etc. However if an emergency stop was triggered (not a ride stop) it would automatically be an instant evacuation.

In regards to making people exit the ride, it makes sense for dual loading stations like Superman etc. And I know back in the days of Lethal and even at times with Arkham it would depend on the supervisor if they would allow re-rides. However you would have to exit the seat, and wait to the side of the load platform for guests in the line to choose the row they wanted and then they could choose. There was no set procedure saying you couldn't do it, but there wasn't one saying you could either. But of course all harnesses had to be opened and closed (cycled).

You could also sometimes do a re-ride on Wild West Falls depending on the operator without getting out of the boat. But harnesses would still have to be cycled and get verbal confirmation from the loader and the supervisor.