Calls for Light Rail extension to Movie World, Sea World

[themagician]

@Brad2912 would you mind sharing what this article says please: https://bit.ly/3ugHP0E

 

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Reasonably well paid executive from private company wants government to spend taxpayer money to make it more convenient for his customers to spend their money at his place of business?

Edited November 13, 2023 by DaptoFunlandGuy

[themagician]

@DaptoFunlandGuy pretty much. Based off what I could see of the article without paying, I would agree that public transport to the VRTPs could definitley be better. DW is walking distance frp, Coomera Station, but MW/WnW and SW is a bit harder. Yes there is a bus service, but I think for a city like the GC, there should be another public transport option. Accessing Paradise Country is even worse though. 

Maybe instead of investiating way too much into a hotel, they could invest that into a public transport system to contact the Oxenford parks. Or maybe, just maybe, invest in fixing some of the inpark transport for their park that desperatley needs it, especially for their resort guests.

Edited November 13, 2023 by themagician

[New display name]

18 minutes ago, DaptoFunlandGuy said:

Reasonably well paid executive from private company wants government to spend taxpayer money to make it more convenient for his customers to spend their money at his place of business?

Oh, like when the koalas buiit Steel Taipan.  //s

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

neither the koala research facility nor the rollercoaster were public infrastructure. This has been debated to death. The funding was granted to dreamworld to build and manage a facility that they would have been responsible for ongoing management, costs, maintenance etc.
It was then approved by the government to be reallocated to other purposes in the middle of a pandemic. Because a lot of projects were stalled, halted or outright abandoned during Covid, with government funds repurposed to projects aimed at keeping businesses afloat. 
Whether or not you agree with how the government handled covid, nobody can change how it happened, and nobody can know what would have changed if it were done differently.

 

A public transport service, built on public land, to be operated by the government at government expense, benefitting village without them having to pony up a single scrap of risk, effort or coin is not the same thing. 

I'm all for G-Link coming to the northern gold coast, but if Village is keen to see light rail servicing the Oxenford property directly, perhaps they could put their money where their mouth is?

[New display name]

I would like to know the proposed route, this theme park boss proposes.  My guess is the mouth started moving before the brain kicked in.

Edited November 14, 2023 by New display name

[STRAWS]

22 minutes ago, New display name said:

I would like to know the proposed route, this theme park boss proposes.  My guess is the mouth started moving before the brain kicked in.

I agree and the way Village put this out shows more about how money hungry they are then improving guest experience. If Village priority was to improve guest experience with public transportation, they would be the ones paying not just asking taxpayers and the government to pay for it for them. Definitely didn't use their brains here. 

[Tricoart]

If any park needs light rail connection, it’s Sea World. The TX7 bus takes 10 mins tops to get you to straight from Helensvale station to Wet & Wild/Movie World, whereas the Sea World bus pinballs between 28 stops before reaching SW (including Harbour Town) & takes 45mins on a good day w/o congestion or unfortunate traffic lights. And G:link can already get you close, it’d just need a fork up The Spit to be viable.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Tricoart

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

40 minutes ago, STRAWS said:

I agree and the way Village put this out shows more about how money hungry they are then improving guest experience.

I'm going to surprise a lot of folks here and defend Village on this point - To be honest, GCB put this out, not village. The shoot is in front of Flash and i'm sure no doubt Bikash was wanting to promote the new attractions before the busy holiday season (despite none of those new attractions opening this season). I'm quite sure that was the whole reason for the photoshoot and interview.

I have no evidence, but I would not be surprised if a few casual remarks about how good it would be if there was a better transit connection to the parks got rolled into a full blown article by a click-hungry "media" outlet. With, or even without support of Bikash \ the park in publishing it.

As they say though, any publicity is good publicity.

31 minutes ago, Tricoart said:

If any park needs light rail connection, it’s Sea World. The TX7 bus takes 10 mins tops to get you to straight from Helensvale station to Wet & Wild/Movie World, whereas the Sea World bus pinballs between 28 stops before reaching SW (including Harbour Town) & takes 45mins on a good day w/o congestion or unfortunate traffic lights. And G:link can already get you close, it’d just need a fork up The Spit to be viable.

We've discussed a tram on the Spit before. There's loads of issues with doing that. This is a bit old, but have a read of Sea World updates 2016 - Page 15 - Theme Park Discussion - Parkz Forums - Theme Park Community for a bit of discourse on the various pros and cons.

 

[Tricoart]

16 minutes ago, DaptoFunlandGuy said:

We've discussed a tram on the Spit before. There's loads of issues with doing that. This is a bit old, but have a read of Sea World updates 2016 - Page 15 - Theme Park Discussion - Parkz Forums - Theme Park Community for a bit of discourse on the various pros and cons.

Haven’t there been official plans for similar since then, though?

Edited November 14, 2023 by Tricoart

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

The GCCC has had it in their 2031 transport plans since at least 2013. 

All proposed extensions are still subject to technical assessment and broader government funding, as well as contributions from private developers in some cases. 

In 2019, the proposed airport line was announced additional funding to cross the tweed border, and the spit line is said to be unlikely until after the airport line is done - so its not impossible, but its also very low on the priority list.

[Brad2912]

5 hours ago, themagician said:

@Brad2912 would you mind sharing what this article says please: https://bit.ly/3ugHP0E

 

 

Theme parks supremo Bikash Randhawa has called for improved public transport to help keep tourists out of traffic, including a possible extension of the light rail to Movie World.

The Village Roadshow Theme Parks chief operating officer said better connectivity was vital to ensure tourists enjoyed a “seamless experience”.

“We’ve got to make sure that visitors are not spending a lot of time on the road. They’re spending more time at attractions, at restaurants, at facilities,” he said.

“Certainly the congestion and the issues we are seeing with traffic is a huge concern.

“I think the G:Link is fabulous, it’s taken a bit of pressure, but it needs to expand and connect to more areas in my opinion.”

The light rail terminates at Helensvale station, three kilometres as the crow flies from the front door of Movie World, and closer still to Wet’n’Wild and the Australian Outback Spectacular.

But tourists using it to reach Village Roadshow’s Oxenford parks from hotels must switch onto buses at the station for the last leg of their journey, something Mr Randhawa hopes will change.

“It needs to be looked at. For us to have the G:Link connect between Broadbeach and Surfers Paradise into Oxenford will help local government, state government, in making sure that experience is seamless,” he said.

“We would love to see that. We would love to see better public transport into the theme parks.

“This is no different to any other tourism city in the world. You look at the public transport, you look at the connectivity. It happens everywhere except for here and it needs to.”

Council leaders have previously said they want extensions of the light rail in the city’s north to be the next cab off the rank after Stage Four to the airport is completed.

Then city planning boss Cameron Caldwell said last year: “All the great cities in the world have great public transport and it cannot just stop at the airport but we need to see stage after stage after stage. 

“(We need to) get it to Harbour Town and beyond because we need a network that actually works and it will make a huge difference to how people move around.”

East-West light rail connections running to Robina and Nerang from the coastal strip have also been suggested, but no concrete plans have been decided.

Mr Randhawa said he would also like to see more direct flights to Gold Coast airport from overseas, saying with the creation of Experience Gold Coast the city was heading in the right direction, but had yet to reach its full potential.

“What’s happened with Gold Coast Airport has been tremendous. I applaud their management team. With the expansion, with the way that sits with the city, because airports are critical to our success,” he said.

“What we would like to see in a perfect world is direct flights into the Gold Coast from India. 

“At the end of the day we are an island here that’s far away.

“So what we’ve got to do is to make it affordable, to get that connectivity going and we would have millions of people coming here.

“There’s no reason this city can’t be at 90 per cent occupancy all year around.”

Speaking ahead of the Bulletin’s Future Gold Coast forum at the Sea World Resort Conference Centre on Friday November 17, of which Village Roadshow Theme Parks is a major partner, Mr Randhawa said the city was playing a “critical” role as the gateway to Queensland and at the heart of Australia’s tourism industry.

He said he would like to see federal and state governments acknowledge that role by appointing MPs from the city to lead their tourism strategies.

“I would like to see the next Federal Tourism Minister come from this city. I’d like to see the next tourism minister at state level come from this city,” he said.

“It is so important we get appropriate care, get appropriate subsidies, get appropriate attention at all times, because this is exactly where it all starts for Queensland. And finishes.

“People come to the Gold Coast. You look at international markets, you look at India for example, typically they would pick Sydney, Gold Coast, Cairns, or it’s Melbourne, Gold Coast and up to Cairns. The Gold Coast is always a part of the itinerary.

“It is so critical. You look at the millions of people we put through the door.

“For us to have that position, the city needs to be represented in the tourism space.

“We are number one, we are the best city in Australia, we’ve got better things than Sydney, we’ve got better things than Melbourne.

“And we deserve that attention.”

[webslave]

Yeah, I did the light rail once out to the parks.  I don't bother now - we just Uber it.

[New display name]

The light rail on the GC doesn't work well for events compared to buses because they don't have extra trains to add to the line.  If you have ever been to the GC500 by light rail, you will know what I'm talking about.  You have no problems getting there because people arrive at different times but when the event finishes, you will wait hours to get home.  This didn’t happen before light rail, with buses because Translink would put extra buses on.  One would think, Translink would add buses to support the light rail during events, but I have never seen this happen. 

If the light rail ever ends up at any theme parks, one thing you can be sure of, Translink will cut most bus services to the parks.  The service will even get worse.  Before light rail came to Helensvale there was a direct bus from Helensvale train station to SW.   Now you have two choices and both choices take longer than before.  Light rail and bus transfer or catch the bus that tours the backstreets of the GC.

Edited November 14, 2023 by New display name

[Gazza]

7 hours ago, New display name said:

The light rail on the GC doesn't work well for events compared to buses because they don't have extra trains to add to the line.  If you have ever been to the GC500 by light rail, you will know what I'm talking about.  You have no problems getting there because people arrive at different times but when the event finishes, you will wait hours to get home.  This didn’t happen before light rail, with buses because Translink would put extra buses on.  One would think, Translink would add buses to support the light rail during events, but I have never seen this happen. 

If the light rail ever ends up at any theme parks, one thing you can be sure of, Translink will cut most bus services to the parks.  The service will even get worse.  Before light rail came to Helensvale there was a direct bus from Helensvale train station to SW.   Now you have two choices and both choices take longer than before.  Light rail and bus transfer or catch the bus that tours the backstreets of the GC.

You say that, but when the Helensvale extension opened, total system usage went up by a long way, from memory the Helensvale tram leg gets double the passenger numbers as the bus routes it replaced, so clearly people are voting with their feet, even if it involves having to change.

If the service was objectively worse, you would see Patronage going downwards

In terms of the tram extension to Oxenford, I think you would want more of a entertainment, precinct and longer trading hours at the parks, or else the extension would be dead after 6pm.

Either that or do some rezoning around the eastern bits of Studio Village and entertainment road to get more housing in the catchment.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Gazza

[wikiverse]

I, for one, would love a roller coaster extension from Movie World to Surfers.

[Tricoart]

11 minutes ago, wikiverse said:

I, for one, would love a roller coaster extension from Movie World to Surfers.

It’s Village, though, so they’d only run the one train. 

Edited November 14, 2023 by Tricoart

[New display name]

@Gazzayou're an intelligent man so I'm sure you have taken into account the unpresented growth the GC and in particular the northern GC impact on public transport growth, which all feeds into the Helensvale station.  I’m sure you agree the M1 has turned into a car park, yet people still prefer to sit in the traffic than catch a train.  GC 3.3% use of public transport per household in 2021 was exceptionally low compared to other major cities, I believe you would agree with me on that.   If I am a tourist in another city, I tend to take the public transport type, I haven’t been on before, just to experience it.  More people might be catching light rail, but it's not due to the light rail providing a better service.

 

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Do Coomera and Ormeau stations not exist now?

3 hours ago, New display name said:

More people might be catching light rail, but it's not due to the light rail providing a better service.

So, the facts show usage of light rail is higher than the buses they replaced, and you're saying this is because more tourists are using light rail to get to where they need to go... but what were the tourists using before?

I usually drive when i'm on the coast, because i have a car. I stayed down there a few months ago and elected to take G link on a few occasions. In every case I found them to be efficient, and easy to use. On a couple of occasions we chose to wait for a tram even though we were only going a short distance, while others in our group decided to walk. The walkers did beat us back to our stop, but it was at a time when the nightlife was "getting interesting" and we felt alot more comfortable (with kids in tow) being on the tram. 

So i'm not a frequent user, and i'm also probably not the target market for this or any extension to the service, but i've used it, and i've got friends who rely on it, and nobody i've spoken to has said it is worse than the alternative.

[New display name]

I'm one of your friends and I'm telling you it’s worse for me than it was before light rail.  I had eight bus services within 100m of my house and now I have one that comes every hour and stops at 5pm.  The week before the light rail started, I got a letterbox drop telling me 7 bus routes were being stopped.  If I now want to go into Surfers at night, I have to drive home drunk from Helensvale station because there is no longer a bus that I can catch. (//s)

I was all for the light-rail but that was before, I found out I had no connection to it when I need it.  Translink currently have a 2-year trial for on demand transport northern Gold Coast – Pacific Pines and Nerang/Highland Park.  Not where I live but hopefully it works out and Translink extend the program.  As I said earlier after experiencing it firsthand, light-rail isn’t flexible like buses are because they don’t have extra trains to put on the track during major events.

“A Gold Coast MP says a mini-bus could provide public transport for people in western parts of the city where regular services have been reduced”.

But, I don’t think it’s going very well because –

“Mayor Tommy Tate has acknowledged bus usage is lower than he would like, but he says efforts are being made to improve services in the north”.

 I also almost certain but Gazza 50% more people riding light-rail over buses was when it first opened.

Latest what I can find is.

“The Gold Coast City Council's annual transport snapshot has revealed residents are continuing to shy away from public services — patronage is down 35 per cent compared to pre-COVID levels.”  This Is from last year.

Light rail is like a roller coaster.  I must when it first opens but now it's yea, I'll do it next time.

Edited November 15, 2023 by New display name

[Park Addict 93]

On 14/11/2023 at 10:28 AM, STRAWS said:

If Village priority was to improve guest experience with public transportation, they would be the ones paying not just asking taxpayers and the government to pay for it for them. Definitely didn't use their brains here. 

Exactly this, previously the parks would charter a bus to Helensvale Station and earlier years Surfers Paradise after Fright Night for staff and customers. They no longer do this.

A quick look also seems like the Top Golf shuttle also no longer exists.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

16 hours ago, New display name said:

I'm one of your friends

Since when?

16 hours ago, New display name said:

compared to pre-COVID levels.

There's a lot of issues with comparisons of late. When folks make comparisons "year on year" about things they don't account for the fact that two years ago nobody was going anywhere much. So the comparisons are made "to pre-covid" but the issue there is the economy was completely different. it's not a fair comparison - it's apples and helicopters.

Domestic visitation to the gold coast on a 2019 to 2022 year comparison - there were about 3 million less (about 20%) in 2022. Considering 50% are drive-in visitors, the other 50% being transit riders is going to bash a pretty big hole in ridership.

I'll accept your personal experience in your neighbourhood. Its a shame that they've reduced bus services, but by all accounts (including the Mayor's) the buses were also seeing low ridership (naturally, you're not getting pissed as a mute every night of the week to singlehandedly keep the bus services afloat).

And you can always get a taxi or an uber, rather than driving home drunk. I'm not a big uber user, but have found their services very useful on the gold coast, and reasonably cheap (all things considered) when we're there for the weekend \ for a night out. (And this is potentially another explanation for low ridership of public transport services).