Bermuda Triangle

[Spencer]

That is terrible. I feel Village Roadshow theme parks are really biting people in the ass with the lack of IMPORTANT effects. It feels like they're stealing things away that we pay for. Someone needs to wipe there mouth off and do some restoration!

[pin142]

Big question is with a pass now cheaper than full day entry is this the price we are paying for getting in cheaper. Sure $70 for a pass is cheap but when a single day entry costs more the discount has to be offset somehow and this seems to be a way in which this is happening. Along with meals no longer including drinks at some parks. Problem seems to be people want things cheap but also want things to be the same as they were full price. It obviously is one or the other and a very valid point of you get what you pay for. Over 6 months of very cheap entry and I am surprised people didn't see this coming sooner.

[GoGoBoy]

Big question is with a pass now cheaper than full day entry is this the price we are paying for getting in cheaper.

I think this is an important point. I know you guys all love your cheap tickets but at the end of the day I think price wars hurt the parks. I'd personally prefer to pay more for a quality experience but perhaps the rest of the cheap asses around Australia don't feel the same way

[Richard]

The only thing these 'price wars' do is bring the price into line with what I'd consider international standards. Our parks are ridiculously overpriced; $70 for a short day (7 hours) at parks with only a handful of big attractions and a handful of smaller ones is not the industry standard. Cheaper tickets should not equate to worse standards, and no one should be letting our parks get away with it. I mean they're profiting greatly from these heavily promoted discounts, why does it not stand to reason that everything else in terms of new capital investment, maintenance and the like should remain the same... ignoring the obvious argument that they should be expanding to cater for the increased demand by way of investment and upkeen above and beyond what was being done prior.

I can forgive the pre-show not being done the way it was, I can also forgive the lack of character in the Cast Members

I'm just curious as to why? The ride is no less popular on a day-to-day basis, so why then should it be left to rot? We're not talking gradual wear and tear that has seen it become slowly worse and worse over the years as it was very well kept for many years, but rather a sudden drop in standards as soon as the current upper management team were in place.

[themeparkgc]

Our parks are ridiculously overpriced; $70 for a short day (7 hours) at parks with only a handful of big attractions and a handful of smaller ones is not the industry standard.

Exactly!

• Disneyland tickets cost around AUD$78, the park is open 16 hours, equivalent to almost $5 / hour.
• Movie World tickets cost $72, the park is open 7 hours, equivalent to over $10 / hour.

For an extra $6 you can get entry to Disneyland for 9 more hours! I know which one I'd choose if I had that choice.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

The only thing these 'price wars' do is bring the price into line with what I'd consider international standards. Our parks are ridiculously overpriced; $70 for a short day (7 hours) at parks with only a handful of big attractions and a handful of smaller ones is not the industry standard.

Thats what gets me too. At Disney Hong Kong (which despite the lack of attractions when compared to other Disney properties) it was definitely something you could spend all day at with minimal re-rides on anything. We paid $350HK for a one-day ticket, and because we were staying at their hotel, we got an extra day for free. With the current exchange rate (we paid less as the rate was a bit lower two weeks ago) it equates to less than $50 for the two-day ticket. Even buying at the gate, same price for one-day is cheaper than our parks, and the experience was much much more than anything we get. Christ - the janitors take the time and effort to sweep the leaves into mickey ears for chrissake...

I'm just curious as to why? The ride is no less popular on a day-to-day basis, so why then should it be left to rot?

Because like most rides at non "themed" parks tend to open with a bang and a wow factor, and then as things die, the budget isn't there anymore. THey're saving their pennies for their next big attraction and they can't spare $30 for a spare bottle of fog juice (ok well that one got fixed, but you get the idea..)

[xelanosat]

I was there on Tuesday, and on a the 3 rides we had on it, there was no audio on the boats. These were all on seperate boats also, so I am suprised to hear that the audio was functioning for you. I can forgive the pre-show not being done the way it was, I can also forgive the lack of character in the Cast Members, what was not forgivable was no audio on the boats, the numerous effects/ screens and lighting not functioning and the replacment for the fire. For the record, the fire was a great asset to the ride, however I don't care if it's gone really, as great as it was. It's replacment is what really gets me.

Last Tuesday was the first time I got a boat with sound and the first time I watched the pre-show! I have to say the speakers were way too loud. All the effects were working but when I went today the work lights were on, there was no sound and none of the effects worked. None of the aliens moved, projectors/tv's all had a still image on them and the water effects (when you go backwards) weren't working ect. I think $70 is a rip-off to go to a theme park with just 4 majour rides. There were two tourists sitting in front of me who obviously never went on the ride before and I heard them talking about how 'shit' the bermuda tringle was...

Jet Rescue's steam effects are currently not in operation.

When I went today a saw that the steam effect has started working again. Edited March 20, 2010 by xelanosat

[CruiseSF]

These problems could be solved if Disney or Universal built a park here. This would mean that the parks would need to up their standards to attract customers and they would need to lower there prices. But this will only last a little while as Disney like to cut costs just like the Gold coast park, except not as much.

[tipsy_bella]

They (universal and Disney) will never build a park here in Australia. We don't have the population for those parks or the money. What you might see from these companies in Australia might be something like DisneyQuest or a hotel or something first of all.

[joz]

The thing I've often wondered is why all parks aren't like Disney. Why do so many parks stray so far from industry best practice? They do just about everything right, the from rider requirements of the rides, to bag storage, to live shows to 3D movies down to the level of staff required to keep the street clean. There are a few exceptions to be sure, but for the most part just about everything they do, they do faultlessly. So why is it then that every other park in the world doesn't do the same? Obviously, I'm not asking "Why don't our parks have $100million rides?". The answer is pretty obvious; Disney are the most visited parks in the world, and even with that investment level our parks are unlikely to ever get a similar number of guests. But the things Disney do can still be employed on a smaller scale. They improve their rides so people who come back still enjoy the park and get some extra surprises. Our rides and attractions can be improved and plussed too, indeed there's some great new technology that's come along since 1994 and could go into Bermuda and make the ride great. Disney also replace the ride vehicles and don't feel the need to paint the ride red, slap a new name on it and call it a new ride. Disney parks aren't ad-hoc like our parks, and have a coherent design and feel the whole way through. Our parks (particularly in the newly created 'Revenue' department) is competing with itself for our attention till you just wished everyone would piss off. A great example of this; on a recent trip into Seaworld there was an obnoxious guy on a megaphone trying to sell photos or something. Not exactly sure what since at the same time I also had Food and Beverage staff trying to sell me an "all day" meal deal (since when is 11 till 3 all day? And why is the food in the picture not what actually comes with the all day meal deal? And why are drinks extra? What's the bloody point of the all day meal deal?). I don't think it'd be a good idea for our parks to do things on a Disney budget (and indeed if Paris and Hong Kong have taught us anything, it's that Disney shouldn't do a Disney budget in all markets). But I do think that taking the Disney approach of maintaining the parks, making them better and not having utter contempt for you customers not only makes sense, but is the only way you can have a successful park in the long run. It's quite sad that the people in charge of Village think they know better then the people who invented the industry best practice, and our parks are left to rot.

[Richard]

I definitely don't see it being a problem limited to Australian parks, but the key difference is while our parks seem content to sell a low-quality product at a premium price, at least Six Flags sees itself as the relatively low-cost operator and markets and prices things accordingly. They need to stop hiring these hacks that come in for two years, slash costs and generally screw things up in some misguided ego-driven attempt to show how much better they are then their predecessor, before moving onto a bigger and better job with another company. To stop doing this boards of directors need to realise that they are in a long-term growth industry and that short term gains typically cannot be sustained, no matter how good they make shares look in the short run. I'd say two-thirds of what Disney do so well has nothing at all to do with their size, budget or anything like that. It's to do having some kind of vision or overall strategic goals to work towards beyond "hey we can boost revenue by 2% by not including drinks!", and you're not going to get there hiring people whose main concern is where their next job will be, or with a board of directors who can't understand how completely watering down your brand in the name of profits now won't be much good 10 or 20 years from now.

[Original]

Exactly it management makes everything, we saw the quality of the parks when John Menzies was in charge, the quality he provided in cleanliness, rides, shows, everything. He had goals for his park, he had to have everything perfect, his parks were everything he was there for decades and saw them from the gorund up; he run those parks on similiar styles to Disney on what budget his company allowed him. There's that saying build a good brand and product and they will come; DW strayed away from that, in the short run they made money, in the long run however we constantly now see them reporting drops in attendance and are now trying to turn it around. It was obivious when the new managment took over, price's went up, lower quality products, obivious cost cutting. Management need to sit back and go, yea were doing this wrong and go back to the days of Scooby, Wild West, Bermuda Triangle and Polar Bear Shores and bring back their quality and for christ sake bring sizes back to drink and put them back in the combo.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Truer words have never been spoken. I don't think it is fair to criticise the hong kong experiment... having just come back from there, I can assure you it is NOT anywhere near the original Disneyland, but the budget suits the park, and it has been done very well. The only thing lacking was the true adventures of the original, which will be somewhat repaired with the opening of the new lands - thats another thing that Disney do well - if something isn't working, or needs improvement - they do it. Park doesn't have enough thrills, and too many shows? let's build more thrills... The thing is, if our parkz got together and hired Gazza, Nev, DjRappa and Joz, right there you've got the imagination and designer, the construction and technical \ engineering, the special effects and theming, and the theming and guest flow \ experience taken care of right there. What more do you need?

[CruiseSF]

They (universal and Disney) will never build a park here in Australia. We don't have the population for those parks or the money. What you might see from these companies in Australia might be something like DisneyQuest or a hotel or something first of all.

I never said they would but they still could if they look to the future. If our population goes with the expected population to be 40 million in a while they may look at us as more of a target market.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Besides - as demonstrated - all of the asian disney parks attract a lot more international tourists than locals. Build it, but make it unique to the area so that there is something different to the other parks that makes them want to come....

[PBo]

Hi all. Quite new to this forum. I went on Bermuda Triangle yesterday. Any reason the space ship no longer vanishes? I was hangin' out the whole ride for that to happen!

Edited May 3, 2010 by PBo

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Because, unlike a disney park, theming is for new attractions only.

[joz]

Pretty much, the glass which makes the effect work has been removed since the frame which supports old is so old. As far as I'm aware there aren't any plans to replace it. I suggest reading up on the 'Peppers Ghost' effect to see what the glass was for. Welcome to the forums BTW!

[MickeyD]

oh that's just pathetic to hear.. I am glad to have worked in the Parks during the 'glory' years when regular maintenance requests were logged & processed for everything from fresh paint to resurfacing. Nowadays (like Alex said) it seems that once an attraction opens and as the years roll by they fall into a state of neglect waiting for the day to come when they finally reach their ultimate demise. I am disappointed to hear that mature members of VTP senior management seem to be turning a blind eye to the importance of maintaining and upgrading what they already have. Some of them have been a part of the business since the early years. They know better and can carry enough clout across the table to stand up for what they believe in, if they really wanted to that is. This ignorance will not go unnoticed by the general public and I only hope guest services are receiving a flood of complaints over so much that has deteriorated in recent years.

[GoGoBoy]

Pretty much, the glass which makes the effect work has been removed since the frame which supports old is so old. As far as I'm aware there aren't any plans to replace it. I suggest reading up on the 'Peppers Ghost' effect to see what the glass was for.

Oh come on that was one of the best effects! I can't believe they have let it die. The effects were what made this ride! What's going on? Are they planning to replace the ride with something else and therefore letting it deteriorate? I'm so annoyed about this

[joz]

Not that I'm aware of, it's been gone for nearly a year now so I think turning the lights off instead of having the ship actually disappear is as good as it's going to be. Agree with everything you said MickeyD. What I would say though is that since management doesn't care, no one cares anymore. I don't totally blame the staff, it's hard to care about your job when your bosses don't, and a good proportion of your work mates have been sacked. But the worrying thing is that the people who should care are focused on just saving as much money as they can for the sake of a bonus. Yes, rather then getting a bonus based on how good a condition the parks are in it's about saving money. It's not the sort of thing I'd normally draw attention to aside from the fact that people are asking us why the parks are looking like crap.

[rappa]

WHAT THE HELL! How did I not know about this??? That's just plane ridiculous. I can tell you exactly how much it would cost to have a new support for a friken piece of glass fabricated from wood or steel (whichever it was) and it's a blip in the maintenance budget for that attraction. I'm honestly shocked it has gotten that bad. I would also have to say that if that was Movieworld even that just wouldn't happen. Managers at Sea World really have just dropped the ball. They seem to worried about themselves and forget they are actually meant to be running the park. A bit sad given I know who most of those people are, and it upsets me that they personally let it get to this. Problem you got with the big company restructure, most of the good staff went to Movieworld whilst Sea World got the dregs. I think for the first time I would actually like them to sell off Sea World. Mainly because I would sooner no company I work for is associated with the state of that park. Sell the place to John and Trevor and let them get it back to where it should be!

Edited May 4, 2010 by djrappa

[Flea]

I really didn't want to believe how bad Bermuda had become but it was all confirmed during my visit last week... Joz, the lights don't even turn off anymore - the ship just sits there. Not to mention things like the onboard audio only half working, the projector showing a blue NO INPUT (or a similar error message) screen and the oh so fantastic red neon wire replacing FIRE?! I mean wow... just wow. It's a real shame considering SW was once my favourite park. The place has lost it's unique atmosphere it once had... Just walking through the park it all felt very cold, what happened to the cheery staff? A couple guys manning the churros/sausage carts were swearing and joking between eachother. Not the greatest of impressions to make while serving a family with really young kids. Also what's with the large majority of F&B closing at 3PM? I can understand that cost cutting measures need to be taken but surely there are other options that don't make your parks look like complete crap.

[MickeyD]

someone should write an article for the Gold Coast Bulletin about this. Maybe that's just the wake up call they need?

[Bubco]

I wish I found this topic earlier, last time I went to Sea World was May last year with my sis, she went on the ride when it first opened back in the day and said it was pretty good. I had high expectations coz I had never been on it before, I always remember seeing the fire come out the top of the volcano thing from outside and it was a pretty sweet looking effect but I was disappointed when I went on it. A lot of the effects seemed to be stuffed, lights not working and a few things didn't move properly, the speaker in the boat was working but not very well it was all crackly, the projector screen part was kinda dull and seemed off colour, the disappearing UFO didn't seem to disappear fully and worst of all the fire at the end was replaced by some crappy looking neon and no steam when the boat went down the ramp. When we got off the ride I remember my sis saying "Wow, that was bad it used to be way better." Fair enough the ride is pretty old and of course after years stuff won't work as it should but at least they should have made an effort to fix the broken stuff and not let it deteriorate that bad. I haven't been there for over a year now so hopefully by now they have fixed that stuff(apart from the fire at the end, coz that won't be back anytime soon). If they were planning to gut it they should instead consider an upgrade/full restoration of the ride, although it would be expensive but it would also restore the ride and the parks reputation.