Cyclone Replacement/Refurbishment

[Santa07]

Well, this has been going around different threads for ages, but now I think it's time to make a thread just for this. Cyclone really needs a replacement or major refurbishment. Just yesterday, my friend rode the cyclone and his seatbelt broke just before he was coming into the first loop. It's rough, and the harnesses can be uncomfortable at times. I know Dreamworld won't, but it would be awesome to remove it and replace it with a woodie or a B&M.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

I personally don't see anything wrong with Cyclone. It's not old or outdated, it's still quite a smooth ride. I don't agree that it is rough. Sure - compare it to some others, but considering it's age (and manufacturer) it's aging quite well. You wanna try rough - go to China.

To the best of my recollection seatbelts were never a requirement of this type of coaster car in the past and appear to be a dreamworld addition - explain what you mean by 'his seatbelt broke' - do you mean it came undone, or the webbing itself tore detached?

Regardless, I don't see that a single fault with a seatbelt that is only a 'backup' safety device justifies a need to replace the entire ride.

If Dreamworld is going to remove and replace anything - MDMC is first... and we all know that isn't happening.

[themagician]

As I have said before, I find it the most uncomfortable ride on the Gold Coast. I have got bruises from the ride before. I just think it needs a new train. When it goes up the lift hill it is quite slow and you always seem to go back a bit before the next pull. Also when it comes back into the station, it stops and then goes and then stops and goes and stops again. Why can't they just fix these small issues and then I would go on the ride again.

[Gary86]

Dreamworld need to build a new coaster first then give Cyclone a much needed makeover. (Otherwise there will not be any proper coasters open at Dreamworld).

I think a new well themed queue building is needed since now days the emergency exit is used. Something simular to the way Tower of Terror is (without the turbines!). Also new train and name. A complete re-theme.

[joz]

I don't think Cyclone is perfect by any means, but getting rid of Cyclone wouldn't help anything; it'd be difficult to use the land it's on for anything of any substance and as it is it's a pretty marketable ride which serves it's purpose well. I still think it could do with a second train and a refresh, but that's just the super nerd in me talking. Realistically there are more pressing issues in the park that that need addressing first.

[themagician]

Well Dreamworld have posted on there website that two major attractions will be getting a major makeover within the next year so maybe cyclone is one of them

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

1. I have got bruises from the ride before.
2. I just think it needs a new train.
3. When it goes up the lift hill it is quite slow and you always seem to go back a bit before the next pull.
4. When it comes back into the station, it stops and then goes and then stops and goes and stops again.

1. I can't argue with that. Everyone is different and different ride seats harnesses are going to grab different people in different ways. There are just some rides that don't suit some body types.
2. Although I don't have any problems with Kumbak (who would be the most likely supplier for a replacement), but i think most people will say they'd prefer the current style of train to a Kumbak.
3. Yes - this is a standard chain-lift coaster. Most of them will 'clunk' as they hit the hill and drop back onto the chain dog. *NORMAL*. Then, depending on how it is set up, the chain drive may surge the train forward, potentially to a point where the chain accelerates JUST beyond the chain before the chain catches up... i may be misunderstanding you, but from your explanation it sounds completely normal.
4. That is something we've seen mentioned here previously, and it is annoying, time consuming and totally unnecessary, but the angle of the track in the station is quite steep in comparison to other similar rides, and the train would come in quite hot if it wasn't. It could be done better, but its a lot of programming. It'd be nice if the operators could manually park the train, but overshoots would be inevitable... and there is no margin for error with the train's parking position...

[Reanimated35]

Well, this has been going around different threads for ages, but now I think it's time to make a thread just for this. Cyclone really needs a replacement or major refurbishment. Just yesterday, my friend rode the cyclone and his seatbelt broke just before he was coming into the first loop. It's rough, and the harnesses can be uncomfortable at times. I know Dreamworld won't, but it would be awesome to remove it and replace it with a woodie or a B&M.

God I'm sick of seeing people wanting a B&M here. How about you go make a few hundred million, buy the park and ship over your own damn B&M. It's not happening otherwise. There's nothing wrong with Cyclone. IMO it's a great ride, not the roughest (Thank SeaViper for that one)

1. Although I don't have any problems with Kumbak (who would be the most likely supplier for a replacement), but i think most people will say they'd prefer the current style of train to a Kumbak.
2. That is something we've seen mentioned here previously, and it is annoying, time consuming and totally unnecessary, but the angle of the track in the station is quite steep in comparison to other similar rides, and the train would come in quite hot if it wasn't. It could be done better, but its a lot of programming. It'd be nice if the operators could manually park the train, but overshoots would be inevitable... and there is no margin for error with the train's parking position...

1. I really do not want to see SV trains on Cyclone. IMO it ruined Corkscrew for me. Don't take mah cyclone too!!!!

2. I don't think I'm imagining it, but I swear at one time when I was on Cyclone they were parking it manually and it was so much better. One stop mid-station then a stop at the front. Sure they'll screw it up at some point though I guess.

[Skyra]

Just to rehash - ride ops can't manually control the Cyclone especially in the return to stop phase - something that annoyed me sometimes especially on busier days - but it's just one of those things you sort of just go 'well, it's not that big of a deal' with.

[XxMrYoshixX]

As I have said before, I find it the most uncomfortable ride on the Gold Coast. I have got bruises from the ride before. I just think it needs a new train. When it goes up the lift hill it is quite slow and you always seem to go back a bit before the next pull. Also when it comes back into the station, it stops and then goes and then stops and goes and stops again. Why can't they just fix these small issues and then I would go on the ride again.

If only Dreamworld bought the old Sea Viper train...

[MickeyD]

If only Dreamworld bought the old Sea Viper train...

If only Dreamworld bought the old Sea Viper train...

"don't say oneday - that day will never come"

[Flea]

The Kumbak trains are terrible. They didn't offer any ride improvement on Corkscrew and were horribly uncomfortable to sit in. I have a feeling that if they can't sell it onto a park for a bargain bin price they'll be cutting their losses.

[MickeyD]

- Or maybe purchasing a such train for Cyclone could help offer the same magic fatal bullet to bring the ride down too? I know it was hardly the main reason for seaviper's demise, most here will agree that the ride was never as good after the Kumbak changeover. Hardly an improvement, more the opposite

Edited August 7, 2014 by MickeyD

[joz]

What about as a method to increase capacity? There's nothing saying they can't run two trains that don't look the same.

Edited August 7, 2014 by joz

[MickeyD]

Interesting Joz I wonder if it would be possible for a Kumbak train could operate alongside an original?

[rappa]

Train would need to be modified to work with the automated restraint system at Cyclone but other than that no reason.

[Jobe]

That would be interesting. Cyclone has always needed another train- it would give the ride the much needed capacity boost it requires. I would support the introduction of the Kumbak trains on Cyclone only as an addition to the original train. It would certainly give differing ride experiences.

Is there any other instances of a single coaster having 2 entirely different trains running at the same time?? It must be rare but I hardly think it is unique.

[Gazza]

There's a coaster in Japan which has a stand up and sit down train cycling on the one ride.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

It will never happen - Dreamworld needs to be able to park the train out of the way so that they only run 1 train during busy periods.

Two train operation only occurs when there is a film crew in the park, or a special media event. Without a transfer track, it's a very difficult process to put a train on just for a media day... plus - where would they store it?

Seriously though - its a great idea (and anyone who doesn't want to ride kumbak still has the option not to) but from a dreamworld perspective - this would only add to their maintenance costs (two trains instead of one) without any real payoff for them except increased efficiency capacity.

not going to happen.

[Richard]

The coaster was designed to be upgraded to two train operation. Management did look at it as an option when the ride debuted at Dreamworld but it obviously never came to fruition, and I doubt it ever will.

Cyclone could double its capacity with a decent queue and load/unload layout, and by fixing those station brakes. There are much cheaper fixes to the ride's capacity than the addition of a second train. And at any rate they'd need to fix all of these issues to be able to actually manage two trains. As AlexB suggested it's much more costly and involved than simply adding the second train -- they'll need a transfer track, block brakes and all the associated system reprogramming etc. All this for a pretty lousy secondhand KumbaK train.

As for gains from increasing the ride's capacity, there's plenty of evidence to suggest that the less time guests queue, the more they're likely to spend around the park. This is one of the main drivers behind Disney's free-to-use Fastpass system. Not to mention guest satisfaction and the affect it has on spending and satisfaction metrics like Net Promoter Score.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

But then they'd shortsightedly lose their Q4u revenue!

Even if they increased percap across the park, they'd only focus on the fact that they were losing Q4U money. I don't think DW is quite ready for a free fastpass system - the rides they have don't lend well to a limited number of paid jumpers, let alone an every-body free-for-all.

I agree the Disney system led me to spend money i wouldn't have if i were queueing. We didn't always get one pass and then re-queue for another - sometimes we shopped while waiting for our ride... so there is merit in the system, but the catch is that Disney's people munching mega-rides - rides that dont stop like the omnimover system are capable of letting an extra 4-8 people in every few minutes. Nobody in the queue notices... can you imagine letting 4-8 people in every few minutes on ToT? Or GD? thats pretty well the entire ride vehicle.

They need rides capable of supporting a 4-8 person 'blip' before they could introduce something like that.

They don't NEED a transfer track - they could mount a second train on the track and adapt the PLC programming to allow for it fairly easily - but it would mean that for 10 months of the year, they're wearing out two sets of wheels and bearings instead of one. Two trains running doesn't halve your usage, because there are the inevitable 'empty cycles' they would have to run to send one train out so they could unload the other. Many possibilities, many ways to cut corners, but at the end of the day - not going to happen.

[Richard]

Wouldn't see any need or reason to copy the Disney Fastpass system at our parks. I mentioned Fastpass purely an aside to show that the BIG guys know that less time spent queuing translates to higher revenue, and that this a big motivator for high capacity and high efficiency overseas. Definitely not endorsing it as a system at our parks where for much of the year there's only ever long queues because they're not running the rides as efficiently as they could.

I can't think of a single modern coaster with two or more trains that doesn't have a transfer track. While it could technically be achieved, I doubt any major ride manufacturers would recommend it for the unnecessary stress it'd put on the operation and maintenance of the ride. The Raven at Holiday World was retrofitted to include a second train a few years back; this process included adding a transfer track.

In my experience Cyclone tends to average 8-10 minute cycles. By fixing the dreadful queue, load procedure and keeping staff on the ball, they could easily get that down to 4-5 minutes. That's more or less a 2 minute unload/load plus 2 minute cycle, and would double the ride's capacity from ~180pph to 360pph. Adding a second train and using it with the same two minute dispatch times so that they're not stacking and we've doubled the capacity again to 720pph. I see merit in taking that first step to fixing the queue and load procedures, but I can't see much justification in taking that next step with track and system modifications for a ride that is likely more than halfway through its expected life.

[XxMrYoshixX]

As for a refurbishment, they should certainly switch back the queue and exit. When it first opened, Cyclone's theming was on par with the other rides. After the old exit became the queue, the theming was non-existent. Maybe reactivate all the old stuff like what they had previously done, like with the Wipeout.

The Kumbak trains are terrible. They didn't offer any ride improvement on Corkscrew and were horribly uncomfortable to sit in. I have a feeling that if they can't sell it onto a park for a bargain bin price they'll be cutting their losses.

Rainbow's End, assuming they don't know the Kumbak trains are bad, are the most likely park to buy the Kumbak trains on their Corkscrew ride. At the moment it's quite rough.

[nitromefans]

The main thing I see wrong with cyclone is the loading procedure. It bugs me how they check 1 side, swap to the other side of the platform and then go back. Couldn't they simply check both sides at the same time from the booth end?

[rappa]

100% of Australian parks bad ride capacity is staffing and procedural and no ride vehicle will fix that.