Speculation and media beat ups - Thunder River Rapids incident

[Hiisi25]

1 minute ago, Theme Park Girl said:

There has been absolutely no evidence of this, including from witnesses whom have spoken openly to the media today. If anything, numerous sources have been speculating that the accident happened due to a ride malfunction. 

No one just simply falls out of that ride so refer to the Log Ride incident six months ago. They probably undid their velcro straps and was mucking around in the manner I described in my first above comment. 

[Levithian]

8 minutes ago, razza1987 said:

ABC News on my iPhone are saying "early investigations suggest water pushed one raft into another and one of the rafts tipped over, throwing the riders out."

There is a large amount of rushing water that heads under the platform, but it the trough the rafts drop into to allow them to unload is pretty calm by comparison. The pumps look like they are positioned just to the side of the conveyor as you come towards the unload dock, as you start climbing the hill. If I remember though, the conveyor is clear out of the water at the top, so you were actually hoisted out of the water, everything drained off a bit, then on the other side it kinda dipped down a bit again before the end of the conveyor. So you kinda just plopped off the end of the conveyor and into the trough where a small current floated you along to the station. It didn't have really fast moving rapid type current, there must be a bypass or diversion from under the station as it seems pretty fast flowing when you look off the right hand side of the bridge. It's normally pretty well timed when you ride though, so at the worst you end up with a couple of rafts unloading just floating in the trough until they wedge the raft in place to unload.

Such a sad loss of life. RIP.
 

[Hiisi25]

Just now, djrappa said:

Something I completely agree with. Big difference between a major road and a fun park. 

And what about those whose plans for the day that are ruined because of it? And not really, the exact same principle applies... I hope when there is another accident on a road you decide not to drive your car out of 'Respect' for the 'Victims' 

[webslave]

7 minutes ago, Richard said:

Look everyone... some have obviously been affected by this incident more than others.

We're not going to ask  members to refrain from speculation. Obviously at this point there are a lot of photos and eye-witness accounts out there to go by and this is a community of theme park lovers so there will be discussion.

I might suggest that rather than condemning others for making observations or sharing thoughts, that you perhaps take a break from this topic for a day or two if you're feeling a bit overwhelmed by today's tragic events.

We really don't want to see bickering, down-voting or other pettiness in an already difficult discussion.

Nailed it, Richard.  If you're having trouble coping with what people are writing remove yourself from the situation until you can.  Some are going to be asking about the future of the park and the ride - these people weren't involved, don't have a connection to the people involved, and and no reasonable way of helping those involved - there's no need to treat them like they have no compassion simply because their only connection with the incident (outside of basic humanity) is with the park and the ride; precisely the things they will be curious about.

The folks here are theme park enthusiasts as much as anything else, and this is exactly the place for them to be curious about these matters.  Much better here than via phone or email or social to someone at the park who would undoubtedly be feeling the effects of having been much closer to this disaster than most.

[westical]

4 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

No one just simply falls out of that ride so refer to the Log Ride incident six months ago. They probably undid their velcro straps and was mucking around in the manner I described in my first above comment. 

They're not designed to hold you in when your raft goes vertical. 

[Levithian]

1 minute ago, Hiisi25 said:

No one just simply falls out of that ride so refer to the Log Ride incident six months ago. They probably undid their velcro straps and was mucking around in the manner I described in my first above comment. 

You're a troll. Big hydraulic and electric motors don't stop when things get in the way. They run until they break something or someone switches them off. No more needs to be said about how 4 people lost their lives. No matter how much bait you throw out.

[Jay Jay The Jet Plane]

we don't have sufficient evidence that the individuals were mucking around, mate please don't jump to conclusions without sufficient evidence to back up your point

[Theme Park Girl]

7 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

No one just simply falls out of that ride so refer to the Log Ride incident six months ago. They probably undid their velcro straps and was mucking around in the manner I described in my first above comment. 

Have you even been following the initial facts as to what happened? It's believed that the entire raft flipped after it collided with another on the lift hill conveyor belt. Do you seriously believe that it's physically possible for people standing up and "mucking around" in any manner to manage to flip one of those incredibly heavy things over? 

4 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

And what about those whose plans for the day that are ruined because of it? And not really, the exact same principle applies... I hope when there is another accident on a road you decide not to drive your car out of 'Respect' for the 'Victims' 

Just...  wow. I think I'm going to bite my tongue on this one. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by Theme Park Girl

[webslave]

C'mon guys, you're surely smarter than this.  @Hiisi25 is clearly being as tactless as possible in espousing beliefs that are all but guaranteed to rile you up.  That ends when you let it end.

[Hiisi25]

3 minutes ago, POP said:

4 people dying in a horrific manner is not "shit happens". 

 

5 minutes ago, POP said:

Are u kidding me???? 4 people died!!! Wtf is wrong with u???

Just pointing out the hypocrisy, things simply don't stop because of people die.  

[Theme Park Girl]

Just now, webslave said:

C'mon guys, you're surely smarter than this.  @Hiisi25 is clearly being as tactless as possible in espousing beliefs that are all but guaranteed to rile you up.  That ends when you let it end.

Honestly, I cannot believe that someone would even remotely consider amusing themselves with trolling during a tragedy like this  

[Hiisi25]

5 minutes ago, Theme Park Girl said:

Have you even been following the initial facts as to what happened? It's believed that the entire raft flipped after it collided with another on the lift hill conveyor belt. Do you seriously believe that it's physically possible for people standing up and "mucking around" in any manner to manage to flip one of those incredibly heavy things over? 

 

 
If they are that heavy, then they shouldn't have easily flipped over, more so if there are people in it. 

4 minutes ago, webslave said:

C'mon guys, you're surely smarter than this.  @Hiisi25 is clearly being as tactless as possible in espousing beliefs that are all but guaranteed to rile you up.  That ends when you let it end.

Not at all, just pointing out the things that people are too shit scared to.

[UpperCoomera]

15 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

No one just simply falls out of that ride so refer to the Log Ride incident six months ago. They probably undid their velcro straps and was mucking around in the manner I described in my

15 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

Jesus wept

Edited October 25, 2016 by UpperCoomera
Blank post

[Hiisi25]

10 minutes ago, Theme Park Ninja said:

we don't have sufficient evidence that the individuals were mucking around, mate please don't jump to conclusions without sufficient evidence to back up your point

Its what called a possible and logical conclusion... The vast majority of accidents in the world are caused by people's own stupidity and their desire to win the darwin awards. 

[Jay Jay The Jet Plane]

Just now, Hiisi25 said:

The vast majority of accidents in the world are caused by people's own stupidity and their desire to win the darwin awards. 

so you are saying the GL incident last year was caused by people's own stupidity? 

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Ok. I've had a theory most of the afternoon. I've held back speculating on it to be respectful to the situation.

Since others feel compelled to try and make an argument at odds with my own, I feel compelled to present my alternative theory.

For my two cents, i say: a raft had just come off the lift and was stopped by the gate control system in the station as the load zones ahead were occupied. The conveyor belt SHOULD have stopped preventing further rafts from entering the first load zone. I'm not sure whether it is computer or manual control. Either way - the conveyor DIDN'T stop. When rafts enter the load zone, they do so on a downhill angle, slowly floating to level as the rest of the raft leaves the conveyor. In this case, (in my opinion) with the first zone occupied, the raft has come down on top of the raft in front, which of course is held in place by the control gates. The conveyor continues to push the second raft forwards, pushing the back end lower and eventually underwater, which in turn raises the front end. Eventually it flips, and there you have it.

Nothing to do with riders not following the rules, which I will admit was my first thought when I heard the news. After reading articles, looking at the pictures on the news, and talking to a few friends with a bit of industry knowledge, that's where i'm at.

[Richard]

There's almost certainly no way that this incident was in any way caused by the riders.

The situation @AlexB has described seems like a reasonable scenario based on the photos and eye-witness reports that have surfaced thus far.

[Hiisi25]

Just now, Theme Park Ninja said:

so you are saying the GL incident last year was caused by people's own stupidity? 

Well that was clearly a design flaw by the manufacturer that wasn't picked up beforehand... I doubt that the River Rapids which has been running incident free since 1986 would be running with a design flaw that no one has picked up on over the last 20+ years... Similar to how the Log Ride which runned without incident since 1981 until some moron decided to stand up in the raft before falling out of it. 

6 minutes ago, UpperCoomera said:

Richard, you are right. I'm off this site for a few days because I can no longer stand the abhorrent BS from those like @Hiisi25 and @POP.

If they can't have at least some sort of respect and human decency I have to distance myself.

It's not just their view or curiosity, it's subhuman rot that has no right being published. I'm deeply ashamed on behalf of them.

And you rather censorship? I'd bet you'd be the first to jump up and down, bitch and moan over 'Political Correctness' 

[Theme Park Girl]

6 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

 If they are that heavy, then they shouldn't have easily flipped over, more so if there are people in it. 

And they usually don't, hence why this hasn't never happened with the ride until today. But sometimes things can and do go wrong, especially when mechanical issues or operator error are involved. 

 

@AlexB I agree with your theory. I have had similar images in my head of how the incident took place, and they are not unlike what you have described. Although I imagined a raft going nose up over the back of the one in front and flipping backward, as opposed to going nose down. 

Either way it happened, I'm sure it was absolutely horrific to all who were involved. I keep hoping it's just a bad dream I'm having and I'll wake up from it soon. The situation seems so surreal, being a family ride I have grown up with and incident free until today. Suddenly, four lives are lost and the ride shut down indefinitely. 

Still can't believe this tragedy took place today. It's something that's going to take me a while to get over. It's so sad

[Brad2912]

4 minutes ago, Hiisi25 said:

Well that was clearly a design flaw by the manufacturer that wasn't picked up beforehand... I doubt that the River Rapids which has been running incident free since 1986 would be running with a design flaw that no one has picked up on over the last 20+ years... Similar to how the Log Ride which runned without incident since 1981 until some moron decided to stand up in the raft before falling out of it. 

Here's a tip - before people really start telling you what they think of your ridiculously insensitive posts - read Alex's post above which is the most likely root cause of the accident - and then log off and come back when you've grown up. 

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

@Theme Park Girl i think you misread - the raft approaches nose down, but the conveyor caused it to nose up. i'm saying the same as you, in a different way.

[www worker 2.0]

Early thoughts are a major computer malfunction which hasn't stopped the conveyor like it should have. We initially thought rider error but have ruled it out. Still very early though, it's going to be a long night.

Engineer and system expert from Intamin currently en route to help with investigations.

 

P.S. Some of the trolling in here is horrible

Edited October 25, 2016 by www worker 2.0

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Your earlier 'unofficial statement' didn't help - even if you did remove it later.

[Brad2912]

I think most of us (minus the crazy people that have come out of the woodwork this afternoon) have come to a likely/logical chain of events that has led to the this tragedy.

ive been stopped many times mid raise or drop on the conveyor, and whilst it isn't that steep, i have to say A few times I've thought if there was a shift of weight to the lower end of the tyre could it tip/fall back down the conveyer, and that was my initial thought when I heard the conveyor was involved today. 

As Alex raised, the key thing appears to be the Conveyor control. I'd imagine (without evidence to back it up) that it would be sensor based and no different to block brakes activating along a track as trains back up in a station. It seems to critical a process to be manually controlled given the gate controller wouldn't be able to constantly be 100% aware of every approaching raft whilst helping guest disembark etc 

 

Edited October 25, 2016 by Brad2912

[www worker 2.0]

Just now, Brad2912 said:

I think most of us (minus the crazy people that have come out of the woodwork this afternoon) have come to a likely/logical chain of events that has led to the this tragedy.

ive been stopped many times mid raise or drop on the conveyor, and whilst it isn't that steep, have to say I few times I've thought if there was a shift of weight to the lower end of the tyre could it tip/fall back down the conveyer, and that was my initial thought when I heard the conveyor was involved today. 

As Alex raised, the key thing appears to be the Conveyor control. I'd imagine (without evidence to back it up) that it would be sensor based and no different to block brakes activating along a track as trains back up in a station. It seems to critical a process to be manually controlled given the gate controller wouldn't be able to constantly be 100% aware of every approaching raft whilst helping guest disembark etc 

 

The conveyor is sensor controlled.