Future Additions for Gold Coast Theme Parks

[KingdaKa]

Most rides are European manufacturered, so how do you figure that?

A lot of the parts are built in China. Some exceptions of course. But even Green Lantern had many parts built in China.

As for expense, cost of parts in England would be more expense in terms of access to materials Anyway, it still doesn't explain the differential.

[Brad2912]

Well it does actually, and it's all outlined very clearly in the other thread someone linking to on a previous post

[joz]

The thing is, it's not just attendance, it's operating calendar. SFMM not only massively outdrawn Dreamworld, it does it in about half as many operating days. Dreamworld like all our parks has to be profitable when there is basically no one walking through the door. SFMM closes for week days most of the year and closes many rides during that time. Even then they'd still probably outdraw our parks by a large number.

[KingdaKa]

Dreamworld could definitely increase the number of Roller Coasters. All of Dreamworld's Roller Coasters are really cheap cop-outs, with the exception of Tower of Terror which was built ages ago. If they stopped spending $6 Million to build Wipeout plus all the costs in maintaining it, maybe they will not only make a half good Roller Coaster but a few of them.

BuzzSaw is really a joke... They could have made the Launched equivalent and it would have been much better. MDMC is OK but is still a bit of a cop-out. Cyclone is now a joke really, another Arrow legacy coaster. The Madagascar rollercoaster is good for kids. That is literally all the Roller Coasters aside from TTII which is barely a Roller Coaster anyway.

As for visitation. Dreamworld brings in 1.3 Million a year on its own, SFMM brings in 2.9 a year with its water park (I know its not a huge difference). SFMM is cheaper and yet offers almost 4 times the coasters, all of which are longer, more expensive, well themed and actually intense.

Dreamworld's biggest problem IMO really is their spending of money on Flat Rides and the fact that they don't really value Roller Coasters. They've spent more on Wipeout than any of their coasters...

[downunder196]

I still think you all need to be patient and wait until the summer of 2017/18....

With the Commonwealth Games coming to the Gold Coast what better time than to make a large investment to take away the potential visitors from the competition just down the street. I think we'll get something big, not a B&M but not a skyloop.

[Reanimated35]

Dreamworld could definitely increase the number of Roller Coasters. All of Dreamworld's Roller Coasters are really cheap cop-outs, with the exception of Tower of Terror which was built ages ago. If they stopped spending $6 Million to build Wipeout plus all the costs in maintaining it, maybe they will not only make a half good Roller Coaster but a few of them.

BuzzSaw is really a joke... They could have made the Launched equivalent and it would have been much better. MDMC is OK but is still a bit of a cop-out. Cyclone is now a joke really, another Arrow legacy coaster. The Madagascar rollercoaster is good for kids. That is literally all the Roller Coasters aside from TTII which is barely a Roller Coaster anyway.

As for visitation. Dreamworld brings in 1.3 Million a year on its own, SFMM brings in 2.9 a year with its water park (I know its not a huge difference). SFMM is cheaper and yet offers almost 4 times the coasters, all of which are longer, more expensive, well themed and actually intense.

Dreamworld's biggest problem IMO really is their spending of money on Flat Rides and the fact that they don't really value Roller Coasters. They've spent more on Wipeout than any of their coasters...

Have a look around, we covered the SF vs DW money issue earlier. Plus teh SF "ride sharing" to make them "new" again at a different park. Plus the costs of shipping are less to the USA, not to mention the Australia tax and all the red tape to go through with council approvals etc.

[rac2703]

I still think you all need to be patient and wait until the summer of 2017/18....

With the Commonwealth Games coming to the Gold Coast what better time than to make a large investment to take away the potential visitors from the competition just down the street. I think we'll get something big, not a B&M but not a skyloop.

Considering the Village Roadshow Soundstages at Movie World will be hosting the boxing events I think it would be a great time to add a major new investment to the park.

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

Dreamworld has similar visitation to Six Flags Magic Mountain???

Would you be so kind as to provide a source?

[KingdaKa]

Dreamworld has similar visitation to Six Flags Magic Mountain???

Would you be so kind as to provide a source?

My comment said 1.3 to 2.9. Magic Mountain is (I think) the most popular Six Flags. And they only have just over Double the People but over 3 times the coasters, and better more expensive coasters.

I still think you all need to be patient and wait until the summer of 2017/18....

With the Commonwealth Games coming to the Gold Coast what better time than to make a large investment to take away the potential visitors from the competition just down the street. I think we'll get something big, not a B&M but not a skyloop.

That can explain why we have cheaper coasters or why we have fewer, but not both.

[pin142]

Because it isn't a profitable business model to keep spending big on coasters and rides every year. Look at what Six Flags did before they went bankrupt and that should tell you why Ardent and Village aren't spending 15-20 mil a year on each park. You can't just keep throwing that amount of money into a park and hope it pays off. That being said Dreamworld is due for a new coaster and they really do need something that is a signature ride. They have taken some great steps with Wipeout, Tailspin and the Ocean Parade area in general now they need to put this kind of thought and effort into a decent coaster.

[KingdaKa]

Because it isn't a profitable business model to keep spending big on coasters and rides every year. Look at what Six Flags did before they went bankrupt and that should tell you why Ardent and Village aren't spending 15-20 mil a year on each park. You can't just keep throwing that amount of money into a park and hope it pays off. That being said Dreamworld is due for a new coaster and they really do need something that is a signature ride. They have taken some great steps with Wipeout, Tailspin and the Ocean Parade area in general now they need to put this kind of thought and effort into a decent coaster.

As great as the ocean parade area is, I think they should have waited a year or two for Tailspin and instead put an attraction in Eureka area.

I also hope that one day they will remove MDMC which IMO is such a one ride wonder and put it in the Western Area of the park and do a really nice compact coaster. Not like Buzzsaw compact, like a Gerstlauer Infinity. Very high capacity (the ability to have up to 8 trains of 16 riders) which is good for queues. I am not advocating having that many Roller Coasters, but if you are only going to have 5 in a park that is quite considerably sized which gets good numbers, at least make them good coasters. Movie World's Coasters are still a level below the American ones and I think they're fantastic.

[Brad2912]

MDMC isn't going to be removed or moved. It's just not feasible. The whole notion of that should just be removed from everyone's thought process.

Eureka would be incredibly difficult to manage in terms of demo and construction, without closing the whole area down, which them loses you BuzzSaw & Rapids.

[Jobe]

Eureka would be incredibly difficult to manage in terms of demo and construction, without closing the whole area down, which them loses you BuzzSaw & Rapids

It will have to happen at some point Brad. I am confident that DW could put into place a construction timeline that would include Buzzsaw and Thunder River Rapids remaining open for at least part of any new construction. Of course, of the 2, and given how closely linked Eureka and Thunder Rapids are, Thunder Rapids would be the most affected. Hey- if it meant that DW would finally replace Eureka, I am sure we could all put up with sporadic closure of Buzzsaw and Thunder. Hope it happens sooner rather than later.

[KingdaKa]

MDMC isn't going to be removed or moved. It's just not feasible. The whole notion of that should just be removed from everyone's thought process.

Eureka would be incredibly difficult to manage in terms of demo and construction, without closing the whole area down, which them loses you BuzzSaw & Rapids.

I could definitely see it moved... It is in a kinda awkward unthemed area. I would not mind if it was actually rethemed into the Western Area it is kinda in. Could make it fun and attract more attention to it IMO it is definitely losing popularity.

[BigKev]

Eureka would be incredibly difficult to manage in terms of demo and construction, without closing the whole area down, which them loses you BuzzSaw & Rapids.

Also is it true that there is asbestos in the structure?

If that was the case I would imagine the entire park would have to close while the removal process was completed.

The potential park closure and associated impact on people's confidence in the health and safety of the park would be pretty significant reasons why it is still there I'd imagine.

[Reanimated35]

I can't be 100% sure, but given that it was built when asbestos was still a common building material it wouldn't surprise me. They wouldn't need to close the park, just the goldrush area.

[Brad2912]

Kingda Ka - when was the last time you saw a coaster moved to a different location in a park just because of theming? The park doesn't have billions of dollars to waste on re-locations. Oh, and it's nowhere near the 'western' area (which isn't really western).

I agree Jobe that the day will come that the will have to do something with Eureka, but i think the issue has and will be the impact it has on operations at that corner of the park.

Edited September 30, 2014 by Brad2912

[BigKev]

They wouldn't need to close the park, just the goldrush area.

I'm no expert in asbestos but there was a demolition of a factory that contained it near my kids school and they shut the school for three days while it was going on, plus there was a weekend in there as well.

Distance from the factory to the school would be much further away than the furthest points of Dreamworld from Eureka.

[Reanimated35]

I dunno, I mean I've seen a few houses being removed/demolished and they just have a few guys show up in hazmat type suits and just put a fence around the house with signs up while they work on it. Not to mention there's a open excavation (maybe 5m long and 5 or so deep) along side a main road around here and it's been open for weeks with a sign up that says asbestos.

So going by that I wouldn't expect huge closures to be needed, but I'm certainly no expert in the area.

[Jakev8]

This kingdaka bloke is really starting to do my F***ing head. All of his post's don't seem

To make any sense. Getting sick and tired of hearing people keep whingeing about how austraila's roller coasters are shit compared to Americas and we should build this cause I want this and I don't like this ride so they should just knock it down or move it over there.

!!!Just f***en over it!!!!

[Reanimated35]

How about when the Wipeout finally gets beyond repair.....

Edited September 30, 2014 by reanimated35

[KingdaKa]

This kingdaka bloke is really starting to do my F***ing head. All of his post's don't seem

To make any sense. Getting sick and tired of hearing people keep whingeing about how austraila's roller coasters are shit compared to Americas and we should build this cause I want this and I don't like this ride so they should just knock it down or move it over there.

!!!Just f***en over it!!!!

If you don't want criticism then don't post in a thread called "Future Additions for Gold Coast Theme Parks" Your post is illogical...

How about when the Wipeout finally gets beyond repair.....

I have been to Phantasialand and they do all their attractions so well!! I always mention Winjas, but Black Mamba is fantastic and this is by far the best Top Spin in the world. The theming for the queueline is also immense

[DaptoFunlandGuy]

My comment said 1.3 to 2.9. Magic Mountain is (I think) the most popular Six Flags. And they only have just over Double the People but over 3 times the coasters, and better more expensive coasters.

1,300,000 people at say $99pp on average for a ticket (not counting repeated trips from passholders) = $128,700,000

2,900,000 at the same price (SFMM pricing is a little more complex, so it's easier) = $287,100,000

Dreamworld = 85ha

SFMM = 110ha

Now assume each park has a base operating cost of $1m per hectare, including ride operation, maintenance, wages etc (and ignoring the obvious additional income generated by concessions which would also have their own costs) and you're left with this:

Dreamworld = $128.7m - $85m = $43.7m

SFMM = $287.1m - $110m = $177.1m

That is obviously far more than "double", and $130m is, as you say - a "huge difference" - in terms of decent coasters - if we say $30m per coaster (allowing for compacts and mega coasters to average out), Dreamworld can afford 1 coaster, while SFMM can afford almost 6.

I have obviously taken some liberties with numbers, however - consider that the cost of construction in the USA is less than here, and many other operating costs (like wages, maintenance etc) are cheaper in the US than here. (This is why I felt the $1m per ha was a reasonable figure for comparison purposes)

Even if SFMM's operating costs for maintenance and wages are higher because of their higher coaster count... even if we made the operating costs $2M per ha for SFMM - they'd still be buying 2 coasters for every one dreamworld did - purely based on that attendance.

When you're looking at figures, remember that every business has a critical 'break even' point for their cost of sales. Once both parks reach that point, every person through the door really doesn't add that much to the cost, because the rides are going to run, require maintenance etc whether there are people there to ride it or not - so double the people doesn't double the costs - and hence why SFMM is able to buy and build more and more than dreamworld ever will.

[liz.wis]

In the video above, was the music part of the ride experience, or just added to the video?

[AUSTHEMEPARKS]

In the video above, was the music part of the ride experience, or just added to the video?

I think it's part of the attraction.